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Wish to End Gruagach

Type of Missve: Public Lists
Date: October 25th, 1010
Responses: many
Posted in taverns across the Realms:

People of the Realms,

For those unconcerned with long paragraphs: The Gruagach is going down. Contact me if you have information or want to help before the thirteenth of November.

At this past Black and White, during Court, Yohan spoke of the Gruagach. I had not fully realized the gravity of the situation until his words; however I have already begun to plot this monster’s destruction. I had heard stories of this monster from before I came to the Realms, but it has become apparent that it still threatens this land. When I learned of its existence as a result of a dream, I sought more information.

I learned it had been banished once before… But it has returned, just as much of a threat. It is when I learned this that I made it a personal mission to destroy this monster. Clearly, banishment is not going to solve this problem permanently. I have already asked a Seer to look into the matter for me, and am willing to share such information. It shall also be posted within the Library of Ivory.

I call upon those with information on this monster and those who wish to aid me in this task to contact me as soon as possible. I seek both to develop a common pool of knowledge such that the Gruagach may be destroyed and those who would help me do so. Know that I do this not for personal glory, but because I want it dead as much as the rest of you. The reward for its death is that it is dead.

I heard that the monster was Fae. As I've recently mentioned to
Tara, why not ask the Dutchess of Monsters? It might be a good place
to start.

Also, and I don't usually condone this sort of thing, but for the
sake of academia what would happen if someone used a Wayland blade on
the thing?


Unto anyone who might be thinking of using Wayland blades or magics to handle the situation involving the Gruagach,
I submit that you should think about the meaning of those blades and those magics and think of the lives lost and souls in torment because of them. And also think of this, anything that is struck with a Wayland blade is sent to Bedlam. Do you really want to give Bedlam a force like the Gruagach to send against us? And if that isn't argument enough against those blades, then just think about the friends and family that have been lost to them. Look around you and remember the faces that you no longer see and the lives shattered by those blades.

Squire Tara Harkon

Squire Tara,
Wayland magic is an derivative of an even older form of magic, known
as "bane" magics that were used for centuries to deal with various
threats. Bane magics can be applied to kinds of extraplanar creatures
such as elementals, demons (hint, hint), and other unwanted creatures.
While Wayland magics have directly or indirectly wiped out uncountable
numbers of Fae because of the uncomfortable reality of their origin,
in order to save the Twilight Fae that are left, considering the use
of bane magic to entrap that Fae may be something worth considering,
taking all reasonable precautions and consequences into effect.

Note that I'm not advocating taking a Wayland blade to the thing
right out, but again, magics such as entrapment devices may be an
appropriate course of action. We hit a similar snag when dealing with
the Aspis-Fae. Wayland magic was on the table for a while to separate
the two entities that made up the Twisting, but ultimately we didn't
execute on it as not to damn the innocent Fae. I don't wish to
strengthen Wayland's hand or destructive power over Fae in any way,
but that genie will not go back into the proverbial bottle.

Thinking out loud on a moral level, I don't see a particular
objection to turning a Wayland blade on Bois (assuming a thought
experiment in which the blade was not imminently breakable to release
the Fae inside, and you had no other recourse). This may be a lack of
understanding on my part of some of the nuances of Wayland magic or
the essence of Bedlam, but if it is as clean cut as I might think,
sending them back to Bedlam is not particularly objectionable if it is
to save yourself or others. If I'm wrong please correct me.

While I highly respect your principled stand, and understand from
who this is coming from, please consider the pragmatism of the
situation with respect to how many Twilight Fae are left.

-Sir Cain
As the person who banished it once before, it should be known that
this creature crushes and devours all in it's path. The only known way
to hurt it is by using magic, however it's long arms will break all
who dare step in it's way (also magic missiles won't work that day)
That Monster lived inside of me for a year and a day, planning,
plotting it's escape out of me. I would not be so hasty as to rush
into this fight blindly. The Gruagache wants one thing right now and
that is to devour myself and then everything else.

-Laika en'Naur
Apprentice to Bright Oakfellow; Magus of the Realms

How did that banishment go exactly? How did it end up inside of you?
I also heard form Tara that it is a bit of a "paradox" as she put it,
as it has one cold iron claw. Is that accurate?

-Sir Cain

Sir Cain,

I thank you for your input, but my gut reaction to the suggestion of a Wayland blade was similar to Tara's: Do we want Bedlam to have a pet Gruagach? I do, however, believe it would be a good idea to consult the Dutchess of Monsters. Do you know of how I may do so?

Since I decided upon destroying the monster, I have not assumed it would be easy, nor have I thought it would be wise to simply "rush in blindly". There's a reason I've sent out these missives. I'm trying to gather any information I can as I proceed. Be assured that I have a lead and am pursuing it. If you wish to join me, let me know. If you wish to know more, I'm merely a personal letter away.

This cold iron claw is news to me, however, it means little to me in terms of combat at the moment. I do, however, wonder what it means in terms of effectiveness against it...

As I said before, I have made it my mission to destroy this monster. One way or another, it will be no more. If it comes to it that I must use a Wayland blade to destroy it, I may attempt to do so. I would not raise such a weapon against a Fae (other than the Gruagach) unless I made sure (and double checked) that my Fae friends wanted me to. Also, should it be necessary, I would expect the blade to be destroyed after its purpose was complete.

Let it be known that as of this moment, I do not believe the solution I am revealing utilizes Wayland magic. We shall see as progress is made, but if it does, know that I do not pursue this path lightly.

There are a couple of ways to get in touch with her as I see it: Ask
for her in a missive, or contact a member of the Fae court as an
intermediary. The second one might be advisable as I'm not sure she
answers too many missives. She might be able to direct it or at least
partially control it from what I understand. Monstrosity is a manner
of Fae, and a chaotic one at best. It's not easily controlled directly
from the impression I get, but Robin would be an important ally here.

Sure, let me know whatever information you have (just keep it up in
the library) or copy me on what you get. I wouldn't expect you to rush
in blindly, I'm just throwing out options for discussion.

From what I've heard, the Gruagach (I'm pronouncing it in my head the
way a sick man would cough with oatmeal in his mouth) was created by
Black Star magic out of something from Fae. Does anyone know how would
one create a Gruagach? I don't want one for myself, but I'd be
interested in hearing about the process. I'm going to assume that
simply getting a "highly aggressive" jump on it is going to cycle it,
and there's some kind of counter magic from how it was created to
break it down. Let me know what you come up with.

-Sir Cain

I really hate to nitpick, and this honestly has nothing to do with the Gruagach, but before someone attempts to contact Robin G, I feel that you should know that her proper title is Duke of Monstrosities, not Duchess. The title of Duke or Duchess is attached to the position, not the gender of the Fae occupying the position.

Squire Tara Harkon

oh good, squire Tara mentioned the main point that i was going to bring up before anyone tried to contact Duke Robin. that being that the correct title for her is Duke of Monstrosity, not Duchess of Monsters. I will also point on while on the topic of trying to contact the higher ups in fae, that it is my understanding that some people have the ability to magically send things to the dukes and duchesses while in Chimeron if they are attuned to the magics of the true court of fae.

also of note. it has been said by Sir Cain that the Guragach is fae. where does this belief come from? I had not heard that before it was mentioned here and was wondering what if any confirmation has been made to that fact. that will hopefully be proven out one way or the other if how it came to be is looked into, but just wanted to point that out so people double check their assumptions.

on the use of wayland magics, assuming it does turn out to be fae - i certainly wouldn't encorage hitting the Guragach with a wayland blade for a variety of reasons, several of which have already been noted. sending bedlam a rather terrifying monster with cold iron claws does not strike me as a particularly good plan, possibly creating more problems for the future than it solves in the now. sending a fae that may not be fully if at all in control of its actions, if what sir Cain has heard regarding the black star guilds creation of it, also strikes me as the wrong thing to do. using such magics to entrap it instead seems a better, but by no means good plan. while it may solve the problem in the short term, it feels more like a much smaller scale of what the wellmen did with sealing bedlam away. a temporary solution, however permanent it is intended to be. likewise it may be trapping away a fae that may not deserve such a fate, even if the monster it now is might.
you may want to look into whether cycling it would 'fix' whatever might be wrong with it, if there is anything to fix to begin with. i have the vague impression that there is a wayland path spell that could force that, if a 'highly aggressive jump' doesn't by itself and it is the solution - but i might save that for a more extreme option, as i don't know if there are side effects to the soul when being forced in such a manner.

Orado, I don't believe I will be there when you intend to deal with this creature, but let me know if there is anything I can do to help in preparing to deal with it. it is certainly something that needs to be taken care of.

Captain Cimone
Out of curiosity, simply because I haven't heard much of it, what do we know for certain about the Gruagach? I know what Orado has said is definitely true: It wishes to devour everything, but it is not so mindless as the Infinite Dark.

If it is a Black Star Guild creature, why would they make something from Fae? The Black Star Guild seeks to destroy Faerie in every form, so making a creature from magics and Fae sounds a bit...odd. If it is indeed a Fae creature, that is rather odd for it to have a cold iron claw. Personal history with it aside, cold iron tends to not be a fun experience, to put it lightly, for Fae. I do also side with the straying away from using Wayland Blades.

- Phoenix Rose Dawncry-Nosetti
Lady of House Dawncry
Elder of House Nosetti
Master Scribe and Historian

Post-script: (I believe I've heard the name pronounced as "groo-ug-ukh" or "groo-agh-uck" before, if that is any help for those curious? I personally have a hard time wrapping my mouth around that word.)

On the matters of Wayland;

I may have been the only one to speak with him at length, but a message was delivered from what others call an untrustworthy source. I am one of the few who know how to trust him, and what to trust from this messanger.

He (Wayland) moves from Blacksmith to Blacksmith, using up their bodies and killing them in the process to continue to forge new... monsters (for lack of a better term). His power grows, even though each forge is destroyed. Each time his magic is used, he grows stronger. Yes, we have destroyed his forges, he has even destroyed his own in his process. His soul is strong, and we need to be reminded he is a threat to us all. The use of Wayland Magic should not be an option.

I would strongly recommend we do not seek this avenue.

~Dame Sir Duchess Freesia Den'ier of Folkestone
Eben Fox
Knight of Creathorne
Duchess of Chaos
Mistress of the Dancers Guild
Champion to Queen Nimbus Borealis Bouquet
Hand Maiden to Queen Nimbus Borealis Bouquet
Knight of the Eternal Flame
Captain of the Lord's Guard

Gruagach, think of it like this: Think of the phrase "grew a flower". That's the first "Grua" bit. Stick a hard 'g' on the end, "Gruag". Now add "ach" sounding similar to "lock".

People of the Realms,

The information I have promised to deposit within the Library of Ivory is there currently. I shall attempt to keep this section up-to-date with additional information that I gather or others submit to me. (If you add to it yourself, this is much appreciated, but please try to confirm it before you deposit the information.)


This is something that has been bothering me for some time. Wayland magic may come in useful from time to time, but is it worth the price? I know of at least a few adventurers who use or have used Wayland regionals and refuse to give them up, seeing no harm in using them. I believe that using Wayland regionals strengthens him in some way, especially when useed by members of the Mortal Court. Please consider that you may be supporting him and strengthening him when you use his brand of magic. I've asked people to give them up and choose different regionals, but I have been dismissed or ignored on this. I'm putting this out publicly for those of you who don't know what's going on.


I hate to break it to you.
But if you chose Wayland at some point and then saw the error of your ways later.
It is too late. You cannot change your Regional affiliation.
So while your sentiment and warning is good for new people; some older people may not have much of a choice to reset there magics.

On the subject of regionals: There is always the choice to take the Shane path at every individual event in order to not use Wayland magic, but Magnus is right that the association has already been made. I don't know of a way to change them, but there may be a method I have not heard of.

As for the Gruagach, to people who do not know, the monster at one point spent some time haunting the dreams of myself and some others, during the period of time when he was supposed to have been banished. He showed us terrible scenes that were meant to shake us to our very core. For the others who were afflicted (from what I hear), the monster disappeared once they woke up and went about their day. However, it somehow was able to latch onto me even after I was awake. I saw its afterimage out of the corner of my eye for almost an entire day, as if it was stalking me, biding its time before waiting to attack. It was only thanks to the use of Sanctuary, an ancient artifact that I was told came from a Church of Luna, that the creature finally vanished from my sight. Unfortunately, last I heard was that Sanctuary had been broken (as it was mostly just a glass jar). Hopefully this gives an example of the Gruagach's power, considering the fact that it was still able to reach us at a time when it should have been completely locked away.

Demetria Highwater
Priestess of Luna

Unto People with False Impressions,
Wayland is not a god. He does not gain power through followers, worship, or emulation. He simply gets a sense of satisfaction, and maybe if he were a bit younger, a chuckle or two, but I am sure that at this point he is quite beyond all this.
Wayland is not an economic guru. He does not make more blades when they are seeing use, when they are bought or stolen, or otherwise sought after. He makes them at his own pace independently of us.
If we deny ourselves the use of these weapons we are merely setting ourselves at a disadvantage. I'm not advocating the creation of any of these swords, but once made a sword is a sword, and if it's what it takes to live we may be using a sword forged in blood, but at least we'll be alive. Sorry to anyone uncomfortable with this, but, as it turns out the rest of us already know: Mortality is a bitch.
- Kahlenar

I see your Mortality, and Raise you three words: Rise and Fight.

What you're missing from that is that while its possible that Wayland is gaining no power from the use of those magics, they are still inherently evil. A sword is not a sword if it has a sentient, aware soul residing with in it. Lets shove you into something that torments you day in and day out, slowing driving you into insanity, stripping away parts of what makes you you and then instead of breaking the blade as we should do, lets use it to harm others of your kind. How does that sound to you, Kahlenar? If those weapons are found, they should not be used. The tortured souls within them should be released. Too long have these atrocities been going on unchecked. No bane weapons forged of a soul should be allowed to exist.

Squire Tara Harkon

...what about bane weapons that don't use a soul in their forging process? Just curious. - Iawen
Those are fine.
Like Candy.

I don't mean little things like silver or cold iron, I mean things that shatter souls or utterly destroy a being instead of just killing them. If those can be made without the use of a soul in the forging, then fine, no weapons that can utterly destroy rather than merely kill or harm should be allowed to exist. I'm not a blacksmith by any means, my knowledge of the creation of these weapons is limited to what I read. I apologize for my lack of knowledge, but stand by my revised statement.


I understand the sentiment, but if someone offers me a Devilbane or Drowbane or Demonsbane weapon. I'm gonna take it and use it.


There is no need to apologize, Tara. ...but here is a thought: does anyone know of any way to get the same effect of your Wayland blades without the slamming down of a faerie soul in the blade in the process? I've heard of Ged being hit with Wayland, and you, I think... and yet if that is true here you both still are.

Maybe someone could look into that.

...not it. - Iawen
Yeah... Im kind of okaywith torturing a demon... Jes sayin...


Bane weapons, in my understanding, need to be forged with a piece of
something they're targeted to destroy, and that piece of something
I've always seen as "a soul". Lichbane weapons and devilbane weapons
I've also heard stories of their success, using devil souls or lich
phylacteries as a component. Whether you can do it with something else
that is a piece of them, I'm unsure.

Wayland weapons exist in a larger variant than traditional bane
weaponry as the magic is more developed. The Z-blade and Puck are two
such examples. I'm not sure if the "unnamed" blade still exists, and
whether it functioned as a Wayland blade or not, but I know that it
was empty. I'm also not sure of the Furies relationships to the
blades that bear their names, if the soul is still in the blade, and
the Fury is "merely" an echo of that? Any Fury scholars care to

-Sir Cain

This argument is so amusing. Please continue. - Nos
Though the topic of Bane weapons and the like has been quite the education; I do believe it has strayed us from the true issues at hand.

Our focus is this creature and the fate of the twilight fae. I would humbly suggest this topic be put to the side and a different objective be taken. A man has taken a vow of silence and yet we talk of other things.

An evil can lead to an even greater evil, and history has proved this. A Yin can not balance a Yin, and a Yang can not balance a Yang. They can only create more of the same.

This path is not wise, therefore we must take a different one.

Altana Cecil of Pax Tharkus
High Mistress of the Jade Dragon Tea Masters
Owner of the Jade Dragon Tea House

With all due respect, we're not even off-topic. According to Orado and
a recent vision cast by Indana, the way to kill the monster is a bane
weapon. People knowing what they are, and how they work is what is
going to get this job done.


Knowledge is how we prevent people from making stupid mistakes with
very, very dangerous magics. This is one of them.

-Sir Cain

Well then the question is, do we have any way of making/fixing weapons that are specifically "monsterbane"? I feel that were it a Faebane blade of any type, then the vision would have said as much, so I believe this to be different. However, I know that the vision does state that a piece of the weapon will be behind the door, but I am not confident in the thought that a simple repair job will fix it. Worst case scenario, we might have to craft the majority of the blade on the spot. Since we do not have more than one Gruagach around (for the love of Luna, I hope not), we can't really make one according to the guidelines in the Library of Ivory that Janus put forth. (http://library.cityofivory.org...apons)

Does anyone have any ideas on how we might set to repairing this? Perhaps divining to find out what materials it is made of, etc. I would hate to come across the creature and have an ineffective piece of a weapon.

The thought does now just occur to me though, perhaps just one piece is what we need. Can anyone please shed some light on whether or not a piece of a bane weapon is just as good as a whole one? Will touching a piece of monsterbane weapon to the Gruagach be good enough?

What Janus failed to mention is that they're also made out of a
material that's anathema to the thing that it's generally hurting. For
instance, Cold Iron is what is used in Wayland blades. I have no idea
what would be anathema to the Gruagach. Now, an interesting conjecture
might be that the Gruagach might be an altered type of something else.
If you can dig down into the creation of the Gruagach (somehow), then
you'd know more about how to break one.

Various creatures have various defenses against bane weaponry. For
instance, armor does not protect Fae against a Wayland blade, but
general arcane incantations (such as Resist Death) will. Since we're
heavily into the realm of "hand wave", I'd think that since you need
to get the Gruagach from "the inside", it is either not a traditional
bane weapon, or it's got a kind of non-innate protection from said
attack. Going down that road, it leaves me to more heavily consider it
as it having an origin as a differentiation of something else.

Again, I'm reaching back into my scholarly origins. I don't have
specific knowledge of this creature.

-Sir Cain

Actually, armor does stop Wayland blades. As do nice, thick gloves.


I don't doubt your expertise in the matter,and I think you may be right in most cases. The times that I've seen them negate damage resistance must have been a natural defense and not physical armor. I think that your brother used the Glove of Air when he swung the Wayland blade that he had, but that was ten years ago.

From my recollection, the Glove of Air protected the wearer from whatever he or she is holding. Which is a convenient measure until someone invents "action tongs". Anyone know what happened to those gloves? I have a sword made from the river of lava in Hell I can't swing. Speaking of which if anyone can think of a creative use for something like that, let me know.

-Sir Cain
I know of a magic item that could be enhanced as a bane weapon using a sort of alchemical process of gathering ingredients and binding them to the weapon. I don't see any problem with this.


"I have a sword made from the river of lava in Hell I can't swing. Speaking of which if anyone can think of a creative use for something like that, let me know."

S'mores? Fondue? - Tarnisha

Kyomi means Rive weapons, Lady Tarnisha.

I'm curious as to (according to the document Orado and Indana have up there) why it takes a *male* to kill it. - Iawen
Interesting that a bane weapon that can only be wielded by a male though to save female twilight fae... Nay, Sir iawen?


Interesting, yes.... but from what Yohan spoke of at Black & White, didn't all their males (Twilight Fae) get wiped out? Will some hapless mortal male who attempts to destroy the Gruagach on their behalf turn *into* a faerie for them?

I hope people are looking into these things. I really, really, hope they are.
- Iawen

P.S. See you soon, yes?

Could a Geas be the cause of that requirement? Is there a chance that the creature is under the effect of a powerful Geas that would only allow it to be killed in a certain way under certain circumstances? I may be wrong or miss understanding the Nature of that magic.

I understand what you mean, but a Geas is typically a prohibition
against a particular action or a duty to perform a certain action. For
instance, you could receive information at the cost of a Geas that
prohibits you from speaking, or you could have a Geas placed upon you
that forces you to bow to any woman who greets you.

Creatures don't take damage for one of three reasons:
  • It is physically protected from the damage
  • It is magically protected from the damage
  • It has a way of keeping damage from connecting. For instance,
    non-corporeal or plane-shifted creatures.

    It's very likely magical protection that is a portion of its nature.
    Though, if you want to go down the twisty passageway of pocket
    dimensions, it is in theory possible for a monster to have an internal
    dimension in which it is weaker, which would make it the third thing,
    by removing its vulnerable portion. Again, in the realm of

    What I'm most interested in is how it could get banished to inside of
    Laika. Very few monstrosities fit that bill.

    -Sir Cain
    Solution is pretty simple as far as I can see.

    The beast came from within Laika. It's his home. He's harboring evil.

    Figuring I'd help you guys out.

    -Shaky David Cash.

    PS. Come ON... this conversation has gone on for way too long without any of us joining in. I'm just doin' my Civic Duty folks.

    Yeah... I mean...

    Wasn't that guy a vampire or something? Like his whole group? Jes sayin


    No, he wasn't a vampire. They just fed a powerful demon making him even more powerful and brought the demon's attention to our realm. And tried to force us to help them... Clearly not a vampire.

    And I'm being told he harbored another...evil...being?

    Who lets this guy play with magic?

    To quote him
    Laika: "I cannot cast seer spells"
    Me: "Why not?"
    Laika:"I don't have protect the soul, and it's too risky to cast them without it"
    Me: "Aren't...you a seer?"
    - Nos
    The general is responsible for his soldier's actions. The soldier is not responsible for the actions of his general. Laika turned from the path of his clan mates at his first opportunity.

    Laika did not harbor an evil being. He restrained it so it could do no damage for a year.

    A single quote, removed from any context, is not an argument which damns a man.

    Until this point, I have enjoyed reading the missives that are piling up on my desk. It is rare to see such a constructive, coordinated effort to understand an enemy. Orado, Cain, Tara, Laika, Cimone, Phoenix Rose, Freesia, Kyomi, Magnus, Mikail, Gryf, Iawen, Altana, Tria, Shane, and Kahlenar have lead us through a fascinating discussion on a complex topic. I hope they continue.


    So rather then harp on mistakes of the past,

    Keep to the topic of the Gruagach rather then smear someone's name?

    If I hear more of this over such a venue I will do something about it.

    I do not appreciate you slandering my countryman's name.


    So to mention it to everyone.
    The Door, where this weapon can be found is in Achoria.
    There is now additional information in the Library Annex, near the reference to Indana's Vision. I made sure to put a page in.
    Please have a look if you need information on the Door etc.

    Laika, when the beast was inside of you, what did you experience. Was
    it an intelligent force, or just a force bent on destruction?

    -Sir Cain

    Okay, so I've been a little busy as of late and haven't had a chance to reply to this flurry of mail... But I shall attempt to reply to what still needs input and perhaps the general discussion.

    Tria brings up some good questions. With regards to fixing the blade or making a new one, it seems to be meaningless to speculate until the piece is recovered and we can see what state it is in. We may need to craft the weapon immediately, we may not. Unfortunately, the door the vision seems to indicate is supposedly resistant to Seer magics. If someone is willing to attempt divining such questions, please let me know your results.

    As far as those crafting guidelines, consider two possibilities: First, we do not know what part of the weapon lies in wait. Perhaps it already contains the soul of a Gruagach? Perhaps it is the soul of a Gruagach? We'll find out.

    As far as a piece or a whole, the vision seems to indicate, quite clearly, that the weapon must be complete.

    ... What's a Geas, exactly? From what has been discussed, it now interests me exactly how this beast came to be. This, unlike further information on the weapon, is unshielded from magic to my knowledge. Perhaps this will determine both why it require a male (I remember being rather confused at such a requirement when I heard the vision) and what, if anything, will be required to be the anti-Gruagach component.

    Again, I ask that any information gathered be directed my way. I would also appreciate a heads-up if you plan on looking into the matter. Not only would I like to express my appreciation, I would also like to keep track of who's examining the issue in case they encounter danger in doing so.


    (And thus this thread over the course of five days. - Iawen
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